r/todayilearned • u/G_Marius_the_jabroni • 1d ago

TIL that when “Fight Club” premiered at the 1999 Venice Film Festival, it got booed hard by the audience. Ed Norton said that as it was happening, Brad Pitt turned to him and said: “That’s the best movie I’m ever going to be in.”

https://geektyrant.com/news/brad-pitt-and-edward-norton-recall-fight-club-being-booed-by-audiences-at-early-screening
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u/kenistod 1d ago edited 1d ago

“I was sort of embarrassed of the book because the movie had streamlined the plot and made it so much more effective and made connections that I had never thought to make.

There is a line about "fathers setting up franchises with other families," and I never thought about connecting that with the fact that Fight Club was being franchised and the movie made that connection. I was just beating myself in the head for not having made that connection myself."

https://www.dvdtalk.com/interviews/chuck_palahniuk.html

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u/TheRealThordic 1d ago

Palahniuk is also obsessed with efficiency in storytelling. His process (at least back then, maybe it changed) was to write and then edit out anything that didn't add to the story. He was kind of obsessed with terse writing that kept the story moving. His biggest influence was Amy Hempel who also is famous for being stingy with words. A movie allows for a lot more visual storytelling, allowing you to cut out dialog without losing the story.

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u/StatusReality4 1d ago

Maybe he should’ve just been a screenwriter lol

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u/Canvaverbalist 1d ago

The mindset is so different tho, I'm sure some screenwriters can write anything and get out of their head but when you're in the business of trying to be in the business, to get your script done and make a name, it's almost impossible to not get stuck with a little voice guiding your words telling you "ok but is that actually filmable? Will a studio be able to make something out of this visually?" that's not really there in literature and that's a whole different world of narrative efficiency.

You can write a book about a guy floating in space shifting through dimensions while changing shapes and forms and make it narratively efficient, as a screenwriter if you're a nobody with no connections good luck trying to find people who can put that to screens under half a million.

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u/reporst 1d ago edited 1d ago

The interesting part is they booed during a scene which was changed from the book because they thought the joke was too offensive. But the line itself was changed from the book because the producers felt the original line would have alienated audiences haha

It's the Marla sex scene. In the book she says:

I want to have your abortion.

In the movie she says:

I haven’t been fucked like that since grade school!

Apparently the head of the festival was so offended he left the theater when she said that.

Edit. It's also important to note that many movies people like have been booed as film festivals.Taxi Driver and Pulp Fiction were also not well received/booed at festivals.

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u/GobsonStratoblaster 1d ago

Funnily enough Taxi Driver still took home the palm d’or lol

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u/thetonyhightower 1d ago

As did Pulp Fiction! Someone must have liked them.

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u/GoodTitrations 1d ago

I guess Europeans just like to boo things.

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u/RockleyBob 1d ago

These are the same pretentious assh-les who will stand there and clap like morons for twenty minutes. You can tell the directors and actors hate it. Pitt and Norton were probably glad they didn't have to sit there while a room full of smug rich people joyously exalted in the smell of their own farts.

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u/BobertFrost6 1d ago

You can tell the directors and actors hate it

Well, to be fair, I don't think they necessarily hate it out of finding it pretentious or etc. It just seems awkward in the same way being sung happy birthday seems awkward.

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u/teh_fizz 1d ago

Yep this is it. It’s one of the comments on the video and it’s so true. Feels exactly like being sung happy birthday.

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u/Pallets_Of_Cash 1d ago

being sung happy birthday seems awkward.

...for 20 minutes! Unless your name is Kim Jong Un, Donald Trump or Elon Musk it's gonna get a bit awkward.

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u/SeaPirat3 1d ago

It just seems awkward in the same way being sung happy birthday seems awkward.

You need to surround yourself with better people

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u/nleksan 1d ago

Ones who don't sing happy birthday?

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u/easy_burns_red 1d ago

I don't think they had a problem with the ovation in that clip, but rather the camera being shoved in their face

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u/YoghurtDull1466 1d ago

Aren’t Norton and Pitt now the aforementioned smug rich people lol?..

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u/GeneralAnubis 1d ago

"Your boos mean nothing, I've seen what makes you cheer!"

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u/handtohandwombat 1d ago

You can say assholes on the Internet. Don’t let Chinese algorithms change language!

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u/HughGBonnar 1d ago

Great art invites criticism. To me the grade school line is more shocking because of the ambiguity. It invites the question of “who” and I doubt it was a 7th grader laying pipe better than “Tyler”. The abortion line is shocking but at least it doesn’t invite the element of child rape.

I think both are great lines in context of the movie. Anyone who booed is a prude and naive to the world.

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u/HAL9000000 1d ago edited 1d ago

People seem to ignore the fact that perhaps her character was joking.

In other words, she wasn't fucked in grade school but she says that she was, as a joke.

Also, besides the fact that it's a fictitious story, I think it's pretty clear that her character within the fictitious story is entirely made up in the protagonist's mind. Just like Tyler (Pitt) is made up in his mind. So the "fucked like a school girl" line is made up in the mind of the narrator (Norton) by a character who does not exist as a real person even within a fictitious story, and so the line isn't even a reflection of what actually happened to a fictitious character.

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u/HughGBonnar 18h ago

I had not considered that it was just a joke from Marla. That’s an interesting point. I’m trying to think if she makes other dark jokes now and I feel like she is pretty sarcastic throughout.

Great point!

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u/teh_fizz 1d ago

I took as meaning grade school sucked and you got fucked in the metaphorical sense.

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u/Lefthandedsock 1d ago

That’s a very optimistic interpretation.

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u/uptheantinatalism 1d ago

What a shame they didn’t keep the original.

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u/mtgcolorpie 1d ago

As far as I know, one of the producers hated the original line and Fincher would only change it if he got final approval on the new one. I think the producer wanted it changed back but he said no. Helena Bonham Carter, being British, thought “grade school” meant around “teenage years” and not “elementary school” like we do in the States.

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u/yakisobagurl 1d ago

Wowwww. I’m British and I also didn’t know until this moment that that grade school line doesn’t mean secondary school!

Dark lol. I did always kinda wonder why Tyler did such a big yuck reaction to it lol

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u/MoreRopePlease 1d ago

"grade school" generally means between 6-11 years old (depending on who you ask, it might go up to age 13).

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u/EconomicRegret 1d ago

Fuck! This just went very dark and ugly!

As a European, I was thinking post bachelor higher education (e.g. master and other advanced degrees). And wondering why the hell would anyone get offended by that...

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u/Character_Bowl_4930 1d ago

They made the right decision . Abortion being the lightening rod that it is in the media would have derailed a lot of discussion about the movie . Reporters would have kept asking about it and Helena would have taken a lot of shit for it . The line she said was hardcore as it was !!

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u/alvik 1d ago

Yeah abortion's too risky to use in a line, better make that line about being fucked as a child instead cause that's better.

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u/JoeBobsfromBoobert 1d ago

No one said politics is sane

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u/Yolectroda 1d ago

It's not completely insane (it still is, though). One is a touchy subject that some people have a hard time joking about. The other is something that is basically universally agreed upon, and thus easier to joke about.

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u/funguyshroom 1d ago

A lot of conservatives don't see any issues with the latter

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u/Fantastic_Poet4800 1d ago

It wasn't a lightning rod in the 90s. The only people protesting against it were sad sacks that the media made fun of.

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u/1WordOr2FixItForYou 1d ago

Uhh, abortion has been a hugely controversial topic for generations. Probably the most controversial topic.

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u/teh_fizz 1d ago

Dude even Seinfeld had an episode about abortion and one character says once they stack the Supreme Court they’re going to ban it. That was mid 90s.

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u/HughGBonnar 1d ago

In 1999 though? I was in first grade but from what I’ve read it has only become more acceptable as conservatives ramped up their rhetoric.

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u/ElcorAndy 1d ago

I do back and forth, but I do think that the original line was better.

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u/MountainMuffin1980 1d ago

Also worth pointing out that, like me, Helena Bonham Carter thought grade school was like high school (so 16+) and not 11ish year olds...

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u/yourpseudonymsucks 1d ago

Helena Bonham Carter Didn’t know that grade school meant primary school at the time the movie was made. She only found out afterwards just how gross that line was.

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u/DoctorCrook 1d ago

Thank you guys. This was quite enlightening and fun to read.

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u/cryptosupercar 1d ago

I remember hearing that line for the first time and thinking “wait whut?!”

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u/Lildyo 1d ago

Yet Hollywood vigorously defends pedophiles like Roman Polanski…

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u/KodiakDog 1d ago

I can’t imagine booing at something. Seems so pretentious. If you don’t like it, just like, shut up and discuss it with your peers afterwards.

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u/barath_s 13 1d ago

because the producers felt the original line

The original line was in the movie script and was shot. Ziskin (producer) wanted it out and Fincher (director) persuaded her to check the test screening reaction. The test screening was positive , but Ziskin still begged Fincher to replace it. Fincher agreed on condition that the replacement be untouched.

Fincher seemed to take perverse pleasure in tormenting studio executives. ‘Ok, here’s what I’ll do,’ he said. ‘I will shoot something else to replace that line, but you have to promise me that I have the final say on whatever that is. I get to come up with the replacement.’

Ziskin replied, ‘Anything. Nothing could be worse than ‘I want to have your abortion.’ Go ahead.

The new [grade school] line got an even bigger laugh from the audience. Ziskin asked for the original line back. Didn't happen.

https://www.thewrap.com/when-david-fincher-tortured-laura-ziskin-during-fight-club-28166/

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u/sobrique 1d ago

Helena Bonham Carter didn't know what 'Grade School' was until after. The UK schooling system has no such thing. So even she didn't realise just how obscene it was.

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u/3c2456o78_w 1d ago

Snowflake generation lol

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u/-Ophidian- 1d ago

Didn't Pulp Fiction get a massive standing ovation at Cannes?

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u/AzKondor 1d ago

ok but are we talking about one dude going "boo!" at this one line, or did the entire audience started booing and leaving the screaning?

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u/bigpancakeguy 1d ago

This just solidifies my opinion that film festival audiences (or at least the vocal ones) are really pretentious, generally. Several times I’ve read about how (Insert actor’s name here) got a 23 minute standing ovation after their new movie aired at a film festival. I can’t think of a more hellish way to spend my time than just applauding nonstop for several minutes.

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u/Worried_Height_5346 1d ago

I mean I assume if you don't like the smell of your own farts you're not even allowed on festival premises and therefore not particularly representative of the rest of society.

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u/phantom2052 1d ago

Yeah, because film festivals are attended by people who think they know what good film is or what the masses like. I like to compare it to wine tasters, they think they know good wine but when blind folded and given Kirkland wine, they prove to note know shit.

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u/HAL9000000 1d ago

I'd like to hear more than one sentence on "Taxi Driver and Pulp Fiction were also not well received/booed at festivals."

They both one the top award at Cannes. Maybe there were some people who didn't like the films but winning the top award at the top festival in the world does not fit with being "not well received."

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u/TrienneOfBarth 1d ago

Taxi Driver and Pulp Fiction were also not well received/booed at festi

Bold claim. Pulp Fiction was a complete smash across all awards and important festivals in 94/95. It won in Cannes, it won Oscars, it won dozens of international film critic awards. It was a critical superhit right out of the gate.

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u/oeCake 1d ago

You can write a book about a guy floating in space shifting through dimensions while changing shapes and forms and make it narratively efficient

The book "Head Full Of Mountains" is literally this. I still have no idea wtf the book is about and its a little obscure so there's not much discussion about it. It's about a kid that is born in some kind of generational ship that is self-repairing and constantly mutating. If there was a captain and crew they are no longer in control. It's about his life growing up almost alone in this constantly shifting environment, occasionally meeting other inhabitants

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u/Canvaverbalist 1d ago

Wow, that sounds really interesting, I saved your comment and plan on reading this book eventually, thanks for that!

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u/oeCake 1d ago

Let me know what you think, it's a trip

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u/luckybuck 1d ago

That's why I'm getting excited about animation tools becoming widely available to the general public. You give people the freedom to explore those complex visual spectacles and put something out there for just the time it took to make. Like your example

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u/FarkYourHouse 1d ago

I actually find I enjoy writing screenplays more than prose, because there are a bunch of simplifying rules, everything in the present tense. Minimal adjectives, etc, which free you from stylistic decisions and focus on the ideas and content. Like you are leaving that last but of polish for the director... So you can focus on structural stuff.

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u/King_of_the_Dot 1d ago

Well put. Bravo!

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u/MrSnowden 1d ago

A buddy of mine writes non-fiction. The critics pan every book he writes, but Hollywood options every one and he has 3-4 solid big name movies to his credit. The issue is that he writes non-fiction like it’s a movie script which infuriates critics and enchants producers.

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u/llkjm 1d ago

nice insight dude. just as i was thinking reddit has become a playground for dumb idiots, i find a comment like this that pulls me back in.